Drama! Big Egos! Guild Rejection and Other MMO Woes
Jul 08
Before I get to the meat of this truly selfish, rant-tastic post, let me start by reminding readers that the upcoming MMORPG FINAL FANTASY XIV is coming upon us very, very soon. The open beta is about to be rolled out. And its retail release date has been set for September 2010. However, despite the optimistic outlook from the Square Enix team during E3 2009, there will not be a simultaneous PC/PS3 release. The PC version hits in September 2010, but the PS3 version will not come any earlier than Spring 2011. Awesome. Since my PC is barely able to handle five-year-old games, I’ll have to wait for the PS3 version. That gives me more time to play FINAL FANTASY XI, which is the only MMORPG into which I’ve put more than 10 hours.
Recently, I declared in an editorial on RPGFan that I am, among other things, a hypocrite. I used to really lay into people who found themselves “stuck” to their avatars. You know… the type who are still playing the original EVERQUEST after all these years. Well with FFXI’s new content update, I’m back in, and I’m back in strong. I’ve at least mentioned it on every one of the last 4 or 5 episodes of The Jurassic Hour. Short summary of the June 2010 content update:
- Level cap increase (for the first time in 6 years) from 75 to 80, with plans to eventually increase to 99.
- Some new crazy, combat-based add-on scenario called VISION OF ABYSSEA (with two more “Abyssea” titles to follow in coming months).
- Finally reaching the end of a three-year plot arc for the fourth proper expansion, WINGS OF THE GODDESS.
- New spells, abilities, equipment, etc for all jobs.
- New endgame event tied to WotG called “Walk of Echoes.”
That sucked me right back into the game after going a good six months of only logging in, at most, once a month for a few hours. In the last two weeks I’ve played more than I have in the last, say, nine months or so. There’s been a lot to do and I’m enjoying it.
Even more fortuitous is that I managed to ruin the lives of bring back my older brother and his wife to play the game as well. They too were intrigued by the content update. They used to have separate characters, but they’ve decided to kill off my brother’s character (who never reached the old 75 level cap) and share the account of the character named Lauralanthalasa, a female Elvaan Paladin. Said character has plenty of stuff to accomplish, but with the latest update, it will be easier than ever.
For example, the second expansion, CHAINS OF PROMATHIA, was designed to be played with leveling in mind. It’s broken into eight chapters, and each chapter had players traversing different zones, and fighting different bosses, with a “level cap” for that area. Chapter 1 was 30-cap, chapters 2 and 3 were 40-cap, etc. Well, they lifted those caps with this update, but kept all the enemies at the same level. Areas that used to require a party of 6 or more to safely travel through can now be soloed without batting an eye. Very exciting for my brother and sister-in-law.
All of this has put me back into a state of frantic activity. Indeed, I am “active.” Of course, that means my guild took notice. Now, in FFXI, we have proprietary terms for everything, so this ain’t a guild. It’s a Linkshell. The specific Linkshell in question is Bringer of the Dawn, which resides on the Leviathan server. I’ve I’d been with them for over 3 years. During certain periods of my life, I was very active in the game, which meant I was very active with the LS. We had mandatory events on Wednesday and Sunday evenings, and other optional events nearly every other evening. I attended most of this stuff. That allowed me to rack up attendance points, which then allowed me to lot on high-end gear and stuff. But, awesome as that was, what’s more important is that the majority of my friends were on there. They’d help me. I’d help them. As a White Mage, it’s in my nature to help and I do like to help as much as I can. However, I did prioritize certain things for myself, particularly as a writer for RPGFan, I wanted to make sure I was always up-to-date on story content.
Before we go any further, let’s introduce the cast of characters for my story, which is sure to rival my last whiny rejection post.
Hiya! This is me, Tonelico. As you can see, I’m a male Tarutaru, and my graphics card leaves a lot to be desired. I only have one endgame job: White Mage. I like to stand back and keep people alive while they bravely charge into battle. It’s my thing. I’m also (slowly) working on making Summoner an endgame job as well thanks to this cheap exp-grinding strategy.
I’ve been playing, with differing levels of regularity, since 2006. My primary goals are to complete all story-centric missions, and I’m pretty well up to speed with that goal. More MMORPGs need this kind of linearity. But I digress. Next up!
That’s Lauralanthalasa (a name taken from the Dragonlance books). Only endgame job is Paladin (tank job). This avatar is controlled at times by my older brother, and at times by my older brother’s wife. Of all the people in today’s story, they are the most “casual” players, with well under 100 days logged. The fact that they have an endgame character with their schedules is a miracle. They’re working on completing the story stuff that I’ve already done and keeping up with the new level cap stuff. Lauralanthalasa is the only person in our story who is not, and was never, a part of BotD.
The central character of today’s story (other than me) is Antonioklaus. Above, he is pictured as a Summoner. Antonioklaus has all mage jobs leveled (WHM RDM BLM SMN) as well as Bard, Ninja, Paladin, and probably others I don’t know about. I haven’t asked him in awhile, but I’m sure he has well over 500 days logged into FFXI. Of note, while he is not the founder of the “Bringer of the Dawn” Linkshell, he is its self-proclaimed dictator for the past few years. Also noteworthy: he has the relic Bard instrument “Gjallarhorn” which is insanely powerful, yet he tends not to want to play Bard even after having invested thousands of hours into getting that one item. He also has a wife and kids and is known to play for 8 to 12 hour blocks of time. He has more than once whined on the LS about wanting to divorce his wife because she mismanages money. I’ll allow you to express your judgments as you see fit.
Draylo is one of my favorite people in FFXI. He is often willing to help with activities, even if there’s no immediate gain to him, because he enjoys the experience and/or can call in the favor at a later point in time. Draylo is an extremely active member of BotD, as well as its sister Dynamis/Einherjar event LS, “Beacon.” He’s got a lot of jobs leveled (I believe he’s pictured as a Blue Mage above). Unfortunately, his role in the coming story isn’t the one I hoped it’d be. But I still respect the guy because he’s an open communicator and is always understanding of others.
You know in that one episode of South Park where the Canadian character Scott is introduced: “that’s Scott, he’s a dick!” Like, every character in the show knows that by the end of the episode. Well… “that’s Shelbelle, she’s a bitch!”
Antonioklaus has some strange bedfellows: people that follow him, worship him, and know how to act like an even bigger prick than him. Shelbelle is #1 on that list. She has most of the same jobs leveled as Anto (most mage jobs). From the first time I entered an event with Shel, I knew she’d be trouble. It was about two years ago, when she started making snide remarks about me, claiming I was an “inferior WHM,” telling me how to play my job, etc.
(Aside: y’know when people are like “don’t tell me how to do my job!!!”? It’s a lot funnier when your “job” is a class in a videogame.)
Shelbelle has a planet-sized chip on her shoulder. She hides it sometimes, but I’ve yet to see such a catty player as her in my life. Fitting that she plays as a Mithra. Seriously, she talks down to everyone and never gives anyone the benefit of the doubt. Everything is everyone’s fault but hers. She’s just totally unlikeable. Of course, she also plays the game 24/7 so people try to get along with her so they can be in her good graces, much the same way she has cozied up to Antonioklaus. If Anto is away for a day, or a weekend, Shelbelle is probably the one who gets to call the shots these days.
Hellick is a cool dude. He plays a lot of “front line” melee jobs: Blue Mage, Samurai, etc. Last I checked, he’s still a member of BotD, though that may change. He plays a particularly important role in the epilogue of the story.
So that’s our cast of characters. Let’s get down to business.
————-
In late June 2010 (between the 20th and 22nd), the aforementioned major content update was pushed through all FINAL FANTASY XI servers. Feeling the immediate need to get my WHM from 75 to 80, I decided that’s what I’d devote my time to so it would 1) be easier to complete story-based missions and 2) make me a more worthwhile WHM for my LS.
Before this point, I had been inactive. Really inactive. I said as much in the post’s intro. So me showing up again, having my BotD Linkpearl equipped (allowing me to chat within the LS), must’ve raised some eyebrows. “Who is this old fart?” some must have thought. But I was back, and I was going to get my WHM un-gimped, come hell or high water.
Granted, I also work a 40 hour job, write for RPGFan (and other sites, like this one, which is where I can let my hair down!), and I got a wife and kids who I intend to neglect far less than Anto must to his family. So when I found time, that’s when I’d level.
On Sunday, June 27, 2010, at about 7pm, I was in the middle of an excellent experience points grind party for my WHM. It was going really well, and I wanted to keep it going so I could get to 80 faster. I get a tell (private, one-on-one message) from LS mate, Draylo. “Hey, we’re doing B2 (Bahamut 2) run, you coming?” I take this as a suggestion. Like, “the LS is doing this, should be fun, wanna come up?” I’ve done the Bahamut 2 fight a number of times. It’s basically like the first Bahamut fight, but harder, and with good drops. I said “no, I’ll pass, got good exp going here.”
I then get a tell from Shelbelle that just says “you coming?” Instead of replying to her, I asked Dray why someone else was bugging me? He said “it’s a Sunday event. It’s a mandatory event.”
Now, granted, I hadn’t been privy to months’ worth of discussion (and we’ll get to that), but the last I had heard, the rule was that LS members attended the Sunday and Wednesday night events. If they didn’t attend an event but were logged on the game, they would get like, minus 25 points. “Points” are tracked on the LS’s website, and they’re awarded for attendance at mandatory and non-mandatory events. This is a common thing for all MMO guilds to do. I figure I could take the hit on the points, and I remembered long ago talking to Anto about being deemed an “inactive” member of BotD, which meant: I could talk to people in the LS, go to events when I felt like it, not really lot on any cool gear but still have fun with the group, and stay in.
Either I was on crack, or Anto’s memory is short-lived and he’s since made up new rules.
Anyway, I told Draylo via tells that I had had said conversation with Anto and it shouldn’t be a problem. Draylo seemed concerned for me (at the time I didn’t understand why, now I do…). I continued to exp while they killed Bahamut and got sweet gear. They did just fine without having the extra WHM around that day.
The next night, Monday night, I logged on quickly to get in a little exp and “allied notes” using the “campaign battle” system set up with the fourth expansion, WINGS OF THE GODDESS. I was on the Linkshell, and when a campaign battle started in Xarcabard [S], I thought it would be worth letting the LS know. I mean, it usually amounts to big points on all fronts; people want to know about it. People usually want to hop in for 30 minutes and get sweet grind-age out of it.
So I say in LS chat: “to anyone who’s interested, there’s a campaign battle in Xarcabard [S]!”
To which I see a lone reply from Antonioklaus: “to anyone, whether they’re interested or not, Sunday night events are mandatory.”
Wow. Passive aggressive much?
He could’ve sent me a tell at any point Sunday night. Or Monday night. He could’ve said “look, we’re tightening rules around here, gonna need you to come to LS events.” Instead he decided to be a prick about it. But whatever, it wasn’t the first time and it wouldn’t be the last.
I didn’t play at all Tuesday. Then Wednesday came, and that was around the time the miracle occurred. My older brother and his wife resurrected their even more inactive account (theirs was cancelled, they hadn’t paid a dime on it for a year). With the removal of the level caps on CoP, I was excited about rushing them through the CoP missions so they could witness what I consider one of the better plotlines of an FF title, period. So that evening we set off to Phomiuna Aqueducts to complete mission 2-3 (which, despite what you might think, still does require two people because of a simultaneous switch-pull near the end of the zone). Along the way, as I passed through Lufaise Meadows, I saw a ram-based NM I’d never seen before. Unsure of its level, but assuming it couldn’t be too hard, Chris and I attacked it, only to die in a record 8 seconds. I thought this funny, so I decided to mention it in LS chat. “Anyone ever fought ‘Flockbock’ before? Just got creamed by it.” Someone in LS (I actually do not remember who) said “The only NM I know is _____” (and they put in that blank the name of the NM the LS was currently fighting). What I didn’t know was that the Wednesday “mandatory event,” which I actually assumed was canceled (as Wednesdays often are … as I write this article, Antonioklaus is off leveling instead of participating in an event), was a ZNM run. I didn’t even know ZNM runs were part of the rotation! “Zeni Notorious Monsters” require doing a Pokemon Snap-style event to take pictures of enemies. Then you earn points. Then you use those points to pop the NMs and they take 6 or more people to kill. That’s what I was missing out on. To be honest, I happily would’ve been there, if not for the enthusiastic return of my in-laws to the world of Vana’diel.
Anyway, after I made my gaffe in LS chat and another member made their damning statement, Antonioklaus said something along the lines of: “you don’t get it, do you? This is mandatory.”
I was silent for a little, and my daughter was crying. I walked away from the computer for about 2 minutes.
Upon my return, I saw in my LS chat history from Antonioklaus:
“Oh, now you’re ignoring me, are you?”
“I guess it’s time to do some weeding.”
And then I saw a system message I’d never seen in my 4 years on the game. It said that my linkpearl had been broken by an administrator. I was no longer a member of Bringer of the Dawn.
It was the only LS I’d ever been a part of. There were full years where I was active, attending every event, mandatory or no, just because I had the time. I don’t have the time anymore. Whatever. I was pissed, because I don’t like rejection, and I sure as hell don’t like it happening when I don’t see it coming.
So I sent Anto a tell and he was like “this isn’t a social LS. This is an event LS. It’s rude to the other LS members when you’re chatting about whatever you’re doing and they’re sacrificing their time to be at the event.”
You know what? I actually get that line of logic. It may sound crazy to you non MMO-ers, but getting people to show up for events is challenging. So I understand that. I guess it was rude, or at least thoughtless and careless, of me to do that. So I apologized.
That wasn’t good enough. I was still out of the LS.
So at this point, I was already resolved to write this article. But I talked it over with the Mrs., and she said I should really give it time to think it over. Maybe try to reconcile.
Saturday morning, I went to an event with BotD’s sister shell, “Beacon.” Actually I went to two events: Einherjar and Dynamis. All told it took up about 6 hours of my Saturday. It was plenty of fun. Part of the reason I went was to have an opportunity to interact with Antonioklaus. That morning I sent him a tell.
Tonelico: Hey man, can I talk to you for a bit?
Antonioklaus: … ?
Tonelico: Look, I’ve been thinking it over. And you’re right. I was treating BotD like a social LS and that’s not what you designed it to be. You’re in charge, I get that.
Antonioklaus: …
Tonelico: I thought about asking if I could re-join, but yeah, maybe I really can’t commit to an arduous schedule. Maybe I should just join a social LS.
Tonelico: But what I wanted to tell you is that I understand your decisions, even though I wasn’t clear on the rules at the time. And I appreciate, even cherish, the memories I had with the LS. And if you guys ever need a spare WHM, I can come out to help, wouldn’t need rewards or anything.
Antonioklaus: …
Antonioklaus: k. whatever.
what a fucking prick.
Seriously, what is this guy’s deal? Has he no emotion? I spent hundreds of hours in front of a computer with my avatar standing next to his avatar, keeping him alive, taking orders from him, working together in harmony to accomplish very difficult feats in the game. Apparently that all means nothing to him. Did he never care about the people in his LS? Or is it just because I blew off 2 “mandatory” events that he now decides that I’m roadkill to him?
I still went through that whole day doing Einherjar and Dynamis. Anto intentionally said nothing to me. Shelbelle asked me a lot of questions since I was becoming “active” again on this inactive shell … I think she’s looking for a reason to boot me from Beacon too. As for Draylo, I talked to him, and he said that he’s in agreement with the policy, though he would’ve expected more communication than what actually happened. Draylo’s line of thought is that, if you’re in an event LS, you’ve made a time commitment. If you can’t hold to that time commitment, don’t be in the LS. That’s fair. But let a guy bow out gracefully, don’t call him a “weed” and break his pearl. Right? Right.
~~Epilogue~~
I joined a social LS called “Celtic Order.” A range of folks in there: some seem to be absolute noobs when it comes to the way the game is played. Others seem to know what’s going on. A few of them bitch and moan, but most are very nice and I’ve gone to some fun, not-at-all mandatory events with them already.
A lot of old friends from BotD have seen me running around, and I’ve gotten the question from over a dozen people now: “hey, are you still in BotD?” Invariably I tell them a truncated version of what you’ve read here. And 100% of the time, I get more than mere sympathy. I hear them saying that Anto’s attitude has gotten worse and worse lately.
Most importantly, I heard this from Hellick. Hellick apologized to me; he told me he couldn’t help but feel at fault for my being kicked from the LS. How so? Hellick said the “missing mandatory events is grounds for kicking a member” rule was developed rather recently because of Hellick. Hellick had been camping a 24 hour NM (that means the monster only appears once every 24 hours and Hellick wanted the item that dropped from him). For weeks Hellick kept an eye out for that stupid monster, because he really wanted whatever it dropped. As such, he missed a bunch of events. The “minus 25 point” rule I had remembered was increased to “minus 250 points” for Hellick. Hellick told Anto “look, I’m never gonna get anything from most events anyway, you can take all the points away you want.” Anto’s reply? “Should I take away your Linkpearl too then?” Anto didn’t make good on that threat, perhaps because he knows Hellick is a totally badass player, and probably 10x more active, and more useful, than I am. But at that point Hellick did start making an effort to go to mandatory events.
In any case, all this happened while I was not playing the game, and not going to some outdated message board to try and keep up on the new policies put into place.
Hellick told me that Anto has a group of cronies who have made it their job in life to parrot everything Anto says. When people miss an event now, everyone jumps down said person’s throat. That line that someone gave me, “I only know about such-and-such NM” has apparently been used dozens of times in the last two months when someone in LS chat talks about anything other than the LS event. It’s become a fucking nazi camp. No one can have fun there anymore. It’s just strict, by-the-book event bullshit. When I joined the LS in 2006, I knew Anto was bossy, but even he wouldn’t lead like that. Something’s happened to him. Hellick has made that conclusion as quickly as I have, if not quicker. Others have too. I could name plenty more people, but Hellick was the most vocal about it.
So yeah, now Lauralanthalasa and I are steadily plowing through CoP (on 3-3 now) and I’m trying to keep current on WotG missions and the new Abyssea expansion. If I were still in BotD I’d probably try to hit up two or three “mandatory events” per month without lotting a single item, just to show my support. Fortunately, the “Friend List” menu in the game allows me to see the online status of most of the people I knew from the LS anyway, so I guess I just get to be an ex-BotD member. All in all it hasn’t affected the way I play much.
What it has done is made me realize just how awful people can become over a game. I just wrote a 4000-word post about it, and that’s probably a testament to how the game has made me a less reasonable, likeable person. But for however much the game has warped me, the problem is found exponentially intensified among people like Anto and Shel. I love playing this MMO, but God help me and may my wife be quick to call me out if I ever started acting like them.
…I am so not ready for FINAL FANTASY XIV.
To me, the solution is obvious, but I’m not an FFXI or BotD guy, so this might not work.
Recruit the crap out of disenchanted BotD players and create a LinkShell administrated by reasonable people with lives. “FFXI Players with Friends and Families and Jobs and Social Skills Who Still Want to Do Events Sometimes,” or something. FFXIPWFAFAJASSWSWTDES FTFW!
We talked a couple weeks ago about my irritability and alarming lack of patience. This isn’t a naturally occurring thing — it’s ginned up by other people thinking they somehow transcend social norms. It’s why I flip shit when people don’t use turn signals or leave cups sitting around but am otherwise reasonable, or so I’d like to think.
What you’ve described here would ENRAGE me. I would go nuclear on these fucks. So actually, I’d say you’re taking it a lot better than I would take it. I wouldn’t rest until this Anto tard were evicted from the Internet or the LinkShell were utterly and publicly dissolved, and I’d get someone to find the BotD FTP root login / password so that I could replace their index with a winged ASCII penis and delete everything else.
But that’s just me.
Dude, I had no idea that happened. I’m surprised they didn’t go all roshambo on me before kicking me out. Not like I had points anyway. Its funny how the MMO experience can bring out the best and the worst of people. My experience is also anecdotal.
When I moved Solaris to WoW we had little but a social guild and by the halfway point in Burning Crusade I had built it into a raiding powerhouse, with some of the rules necessary to maintain order and discipline in events. I did however maintain respect and understanding for people’s lives and interests.
Flash forward to last year when I retired from WoW and went to Aion. After several attempts to build an active legion fall apart, I ended up trying to go back to WoW and found I was no longer one of the cool kids. Even though I was the progenitor and raid leader for almost 4 years, I felt like a second class citizen. These people were supposed to be my friends. Hell, half of these people even came to my wedding, yet barely had time to say hello after I had retired. So much for broadening my horizons.
I guess what i’m trying to say is, I totally sympathize with what you’ve gone through, and it breaks my heart to see people put the game before friendships. To an extent I was alot like Anto, motivated to take the group through it all, to build a team I could be poud of, etc. etc. However my time as an MMO nomad has taught me that there are more important things in having a virtual existence. In Anto’s case – its obvious he’s not happy with his life, so he’s built up this persona of self-importance online to fill that need. I’m sure in his mind it was a conflict of interest, but the complete lack of communication and cronyism is going to rip that LS apart eventually.
Sadly, it’s not just BotD, I’ve found the majority of the community in FFXI to have spiraled down-hill into indifference. Nobody likes to help anyone with anything unless they are getting something out of it. Maybe its the nature of the beast, with how much time anything in XI requires, maybe it’s boredom. Who knows, but the impression I get is of a lot of self-centered people not having any fun with each other and looking at gear for self-fulfillment. Frankly FXIV can’t come soon enough. It’s a time to start over, hopefully with the knowledge of what makes the experience fulfilling, instead of derivative. I also hope its casual-friendly nature turns off the elitists who parade around XI.
I really think you are more than ready for XIV, if at the very least to give you a good reason to cut the cord and start fresh with new people.
Man, i know EXACTLY how you feel. why else do you think i left botd. sure the few LSes i was in afterwards weren’t all that great and ended up breaking, but i ended up having more fun once out of that nazi camp that i had when i was there. Anto seriously needs a reality check, and i think it’ll happened when he leasts expects it. Yeah, i wasn’t the most active player in that LS, hell i entered it with just thf at 75; but by time i left it i had drk and rng at 75 too. I believe it was me that had a new rule created just for me, which is if you don’t show up to EVERY mandatory event (and at the time, Anto and his lackies were trying to make every day some kind of stupid mandatory thing) that you don’t get to lot anything from any event. I just rolled my eyes and kept on playing the game the way i wanted to.
Shel, she became such a BITCH after i quit beacon for a high class Dynamis shell. Tone, if i were you, i’d apply to Alttab. I know HPG, even have him as a friend on facebook. they had a rule where you had to attend 4 dynamis runs in a row, but there were exceptions made, like with me. I was working 2 jobs when i join them so i was allowed to attend just the wednesday night runs and not get penalized. Shel bitched and complained so much when i post my quiting on the crappy beacon shell on KI (not too too smart, but it was worth it lol. especially after being the only one that knew every pull in dynamis and being told that i sucked at pulling by people that were too scared to do it lol).
But now-a-days, I’m happy i left FFXI when i did. it’s left me keep a little bit of extra cash in my account each month and i don’t have to be addicted to a game i don’t belive in anymore. I may try XIV, but only the free month version once it comes out for PS3. I’m waiting on The Old Repulic, which will prolly blast XI and XIV out of the water with relative ease.
Their were only 2 nights out a 7 day week that were not mandatory is that too much to ask if you are on?
Hellick btw has been at events more since the change in rules, which I assume you did not read and were up on the ls forum.
The fact that you result to personal attacks disappoints me a bit too. Good luck with whatever you do Pat.
I’m not sure how the writer of this can claim he has “friend” in this linkshell if he is never on. As a member of BotD, I remember Tonelico from very few instances – namely when new content would come out, he would log into the game and ask for help repeatedly, yet he would rarely help others when they asked for help because he always had his own agenda.
Being a sporadic member of a linkshell such as BotD, I’m not sure how much Tonelico can claim he had friendships. It doesn’t seem like Tonelico put much into these so-called “friendships” to start with.
Three letters to Leik – LOL Leik thought he could be in an “end-game” linkshell without having half of the “end-game” content complete, but then proceeds to blame others. Tsk tsk.
And who knows, maybe this Shelbelle had the right idea – maybe Tonelico isn’t very good at his job and maybe she was giving him pointers. I don’t know, I never felt the urge to help him nor have I been on a Beacon run with him in attendance. I can say that Shel has been extremely helpful to me since I had to start over from scratch, and not once belittled me like Draylo has (Draylo is the king of degrading comments about one’s FICTICIOUS armor).
All-in-all, it sounds like Tonelico is hurt and angry about being booted from the linkshell, but I for one agree with the decision. It is not a social linkshell nor was Tonelico there often enough to foster friendships.
I will side with Shel since she is my wife and I find it really cowardly to post some thing like this and not really say anything to any one but to berate them behind their back. Tone, you were never on except when it please you (usually when new content was introduced) and you always asked LS members to help you so you could write about it. Maybe if you put more time into the relationships in the LS and not just pop on every 6 months then maybe most people would not be so offended when you would show up on event night and not participate. The rules are the rules and they have been that way since I can remember.
Leik, you could pull with out getting the entire zone and if you think that you were the only one who knew the pulls in dynamis, you are sadly mistaken. It is good that you retired, that way 25 people don’t have to die every 5 mins in dynamis.
Anto is a good leader, just because he doesn’t hold your hand and tell you what you need to do doesn’t make him a bad leader. You were warned about what you were doing and then you were kicked. I happen to agree with Anto on how he handled it. It doens’t take but a sec to say AFK or to send the LS leader a tell or PM to take care of it. Also Anto holds the LS, not a pearl or a sac, but the LS, making him the leader. As to my understanding some years ago the original leaders were banned from the game for doing stupid things.
Hopefully you find some people on the game that don’t mind being used. Leik should stay retired as well.
I am so so happy someone else has wised up and really noticed what botd is all about. I’ve been saying it for years but because I was just another member that left, I was nothing but garbage and I was to be treated as such.
It’s not like this was something recent. This has been going on since Anto came into leadership. People can go ahead and disagree with everything said or choose to believe it. No one knows exactly what happens behind the scenes of the real botd, ecept for the “clique”. This “clique” comprises of Anto and his sack holder minions, which he uses for his world domination.
Only people like us will really know what those back stabbing cowards are all about and we have the tangible proof. All they will have is broken friendships and lists of denials.
I will admit that over the years, botd has geared some exceptional players and conquered multitudes of game content, but that’s it. They’ve never moved above that. They recruit noob after noob and force themselves to be stuck in 2004 content.
Anto’s philosophy: Quantity over Quality and it will always stay as such.
You’re right kryton, i could pull the whole zone without killing anyone. Not my fault beacon couldn’t kill fast enough to make it worth it. Me having to wait till there was just one mob to be fought before pulling cause many of the members couldn’t hack fighting more then one.
@confused BOTD member. come out of the shadows and tell us your name; or do you fear retribution of a retired FFXI player. I found that tone was both helpful and friendly and look, he actually has a life outside of this game, unlike a certain few people that i won’t name.
It’s a known fact that all the people that are still in botd won’t agree with what tone wrote because they are all too scared to speak out. Afraid that Anto and his generals will see what they said and kick them out of the beginner shell.
That confused botd member is most likely Sinisterkill (original)/Nyrin, who has a grudge against me because as a sac I didn’t like how he kicked a member from the ls due to a personal RL grudge and acted so childishly about how he went about it, without informing me or anyone else as to why. I never “belittled” your gear at all, never even examined you. It’s funny coming from someone who is also never at events that you would say that, hell I don’t even remember you the majority of the time when you had Sinisterkill coming to events. You skipped a lot to level your new character instead of using old character to help us and Anto was okay with it.
For the record, I left BOTD but I feel explaining what happened over a public forum wouldn’t do much for either side. I will say that a few in that LS need to evaluate how they treat other people, whether it be holding grudges and being two-faced or having ego’s and trying to be above others in a video game.
It’s funny how everyone who has been kicked from or quit BotD likes to say how the current members are scared and how Anto is such an unfair person and shit.
What’s really funny is some of the leaders of the HNMLS shells think Anto is too nice.
Leik being ousted was a long time coming since you even said you had no desire to get sea yet when we were on sea week you would sit in shell doing campaign or exp. You lvled 3 jobs to 75 yet did not get sea access in your spare time?
Nats we think you are garbage because correct me if I’m wrong you decided to assert yourself to get into a former player’s personal business (I won’t name him out of respect). You sent his wife e-mails claiming he was cheating on him with girls in game and all sorts of stuff. Deny it if you want.
BotD is a very fair ls in my opinion which is biased of course. Can’t wait to see how this pans out.
I’m pretty aware of who you’re implying. For the record, she came to me and I asked as honestly as I could. I’m not really sure why said person named me since I had nothing to do with any “personal” circumstances. I’ll be glad to provide the e-mails, but I don’t quite understand why honestly makes me “garbage”.
It’s a shame that’s the best blow that you could throw at me. If there’s anything else you care to add go right ahead. This seems like it’s going to be in for the long haul.
Edit Meant to say: For the record, she came to me and I answered as honestly as I could.
Go me for not proof reading before sending.
It’s hilarious that Leik calls BotD a “beginner shell” when he couldn’t even master the content to do all of the BotD events XD And I’m sure Kryton meant “couldn’t” but considering Leik is retired, he sure spends a lot of time trolling FFXI forums. Seems a little stalker-ish to me.
This entire thing is hilarious! I mean, really. What does any of this have to do with our lives? Not a damn thing. The person behind the player “Tonelico” knows nothing about anything important about anyone, so why take it personally? Anyone who knows Anto beyond the character knows that he’s a devoted father and husband. That far out-weighs anything some anonymous person can blather on about in a self-satisfying blog about why he was kicked out of a digital clubhouse. Besides, it’s not like someone woke up and was like, “Oh hey, I think I’ll kick Tonelico today.”
Grow up, play the game, live your life, stop judging. Period.
of course i troll; everyone that quit XI trolls the forums. Hell i saw Joesnow make a post on KI a while back and he’s be done with XI for a much longer time then me. gotta find some way to occupy my time when i’m not playing on my PS3, heading out and about, at work, sleeping, or eating.
And to whoever this guess-who person is, you forget that each time i asked for help to do one of the CoP missions, all i would get is Silence. For an LS that claimed it would help anyone in the shell, it sure did choose only certain people to get that help. But what do i know, right? i’ve found life much more exciting now that i don’t have to log into XI everyday to see what you kids are up to
I think (and don’t get me wrong because I don’t know and it’s always been under the assumption) that mostly people feel apprehensive about you, Tone, is because your character was being played by someone who trashed BotD many times before. Like everyone who claims “Oh (suchandsuch) was playing my character then. It’s all good i’m back!” and then doesn’t rationalize the BS that happens between these interactions with said character. People don’t like that kind of BS either.
I’ve always had respect for you, Tone, and considered you as a close friend on FFXI. This doesn’t at all sound like the Tone I know. You used to bash people for the same stuff you did in LS and for what? To get punished because you did the same thing? I do hope this is a troll post. Btw I semi-quit so hope to see the real Tone in game someday.
Dray: Fuck you. I miss you =(
Leik: LoL Because the LS points page is littered with CoP mission completes dating as far back as 2006. Nice try dude. I still love your ass though.
Nats: Honestly I stayed friends with you because I saw the same “Go nowhere” from BotD which prompted my leaving for Empire (which I had TONS of fun). But you like most people, you’ve jumped ship to so many shells and tossed so many because you felt you were mistreated, you probably don’t even know who your friends are or what they’re about (lol to you for bringing up drama you can’t get away from). That’s why I rejoined BotD. I never said Anto wasn’t a good leader or BotD wasn’t a good shell; they are! I just wanted a change so I did and got my taste and wanted to go back to where my FRIENDS were. After changing shells for the umpteenth time, did you ever make friends that stuck with you from shell to shell so you could play with them? Ever reflect on yourself sometimes to see how your behavior affects those around you?
Fail blog is fail.
Hmmm… Couple of things here Dray:
1. Confused BotD member is not me. I always post my name ..if I ever bother posting at all. So guess again.
2. I wasn’t aware I had a grudge against anyone. Frankly I always thought we got along fine. Which is confusing… lol.
3. I was a sack long before you had ever even heard of BotD, and I asked Anto to remove my leader status because I could not contribute as much as I had in the past. You are correct I haven’t been active in quite some time due to financial issues I had to go through in the past few years. I’m not 20 something living at home with Mom and Dad. Basically had to start over from scratch @ 33. So I had crap to deal with; Such is life.
My original character was Jarko and you can ask any of the founding members what my level of contribution was when I was able to play on a regular basis.
4. Me removing Shadow doesn’t concern you. I did not do so on a whim as you seem to think. If I had I would have been gone, and Shadow would have been reinstated. Period. It was above your pay grade, and that’s about all you will know.
5. I may not be anywhere near as active as I was in the past but I still contribute where I can. Currently I work 2 fulltime jobs and yet I still keep my account active because this is not just some end game shell to me, this is my home, these are my friends. People I’ve known for 8 years, and some for years before ffxi was even released. People who have stuck by me through the good and the bad and the LOL’s. Together we’ve enjoyed a lot of success, and it’s been fun. This is my family; BotD is my home.
6. I don’t much care to respond to posts like Toni’s as general rule. Personally I find them to read like something written by a disgruntled employee. These people carry their problems with them wherever they go like a security blanket. If you really are done with something then move on. Focus on the positive and enjoy the game. Or if you prefer being miserable then carry on.
I won’t be posting here again. ..Just not my thing. Best of luck.
In the last year, I’ve been in two shells. WhiteWidow and the now Apathy Remake. Yes, I made tons of friend of both along the way. Some of which I’m still in contact after they long quit the game or server hopped. I’m not really seeing where you were going with that. I never said that every LS ever treated me badly. Yes, Empire was awesome but the fallout of the Carbuncle take over and the LS bank mysteriously “going missing” were the only big things that went wrong there to me.
But really, where is this talk coming from? If I’ve been in so many shells and jumped ship on so many, what were they? Since 05 I’ve been in BotD, Empire (and the like remakes there after), WhiteWidow, and my current Relics. BotD was the only one I “jumped ship” on. Empire and WhiteWidow split on their own difference but none influenced by me.
Everyone’s behavior is at fault at their respective times. We all have our reasons or sometimes people just plain don’t understand 1/2 the time. I’m not sitting here typing acting like I’m the best shit in the world, not asking for awards or gold stars for calling people out or defending myself. Only stating what I knew from a time once was.
People are so quick to judge, so hasty, with out stopping to think of the other people’s intentions. Sure, you perceive that I was being a bitch. But really, when the times mattered, when did I not have good intentions when a friend needed it? I’m not that bad of a person when you treat me fairly like a human being. After a point, people just threw that out the window. So yeah, during my time in botd, I was walked over, laughed about, talked shit about, used, misunderstood, and I got sick of it. Why should I give you respect and treat you any better when you won’t do the same in return?
If I even decided to stay in botd instead of leaving for Empire, I would have been kicked during one of Anto’s rage fits or I’d just be plain out miserable. The shell was a good start for me, but I’ve since moved to better things with groups of people who see past me as just some other bitch gamer chick on ffxi.
A lot of us have had our fair share of trashing each other, trashing botd, being butt hurt over being kicked or a friend being kicked, ranting, what have you. Til FFXI dies, that won’t stop happening. It’s human nature. Everyone has to walk out feeling like the got in the last word.
Glad to know Neph, the really all this time, you weren’t really a friend at all. When did I ever do you wrong?
Rabble Rabble Rabble Rabble! Drama Drama Drama Drama! I demand more backstabbing!
It is with great pleasure that I bring some closure to this apparent suffering and neglect you believe you’ve experienced after partaking in the ‘injustice’ that is being kicked from a linkshell you rarely participated in in the first place. This has nothing to do with specific members feeling any particular way about others; nor does it touch on the subject of anyone being a product of favoritism.
The bottom line, Mr. Lico, is that you were expendable.
‘Why is this?’ You might ask. Lets bring a couple points to prove the theory:
a)The fact that you magically appear every 6 months to a year and ask for help in getting something achieved for yourself, achieve it, and disappear again.
b)Appear instantly ‘afk’ when it is time to gather for a linkshell event.
How you are still bothered by your removal of this linkshell is beyond my recognition. If you forgot about the overall premise of the linkshell, the so-called ‘mission statement’, let me refresh your memory:
“BotD was established so that friends and players with common interests would have a place to call home. As a family, we strive for excellence in the areas of Sky, Sea, Cop missions, Zilart missions and any other missions coming from the Final Fantasy Database.”
Now, most of the people that have already posted here will immediately dispute the ‘family’ aspect, I understand this. I implore anyone here to give me a full-fledged example of a family that is free from the grip of dysfunction.
The bottom line reason for your removal should be crystal clear to you Mr. Lico.
You were only in Bringer of the Dawn to benefit yourself. BoTD reserves the right to remove selfish people like you.
“One thing that cannot and will not be tolerated is for people that come only to sky/sea raids and kirin runs and never show up in the LS for anything else. If you come for an item you want and then never show up again until you need another item, you will be dismissed from our services.”
This applies to missions/quests. It is give and take when it comes to working with others to attain a goal. To dumb it down for you – we scratch your back, you scratch ours. In the end, you proved yourself to be the only one being ‘scratched’, and it was decided that you were not worthy of being in the linkshell if you weren’t going participate in mandatory events.
Hopefully this shed some light on the drama-nuke you placed on the internet. Perhaps if you were a little more considerate of others in-game it would have warranted a different outcome, and this wall of text looking for sympathy would never have come to fruition.
Source: http://botdls.com/GeneralInformation.cfm
All right, Internet people. Much as I appreciate the one-day traffic bump, “Tonelico” and I do our little “fail blog is fail” thing for ourselves, and this madness has to stop. I’ve been selectively approving these comments — I squelched only one, which called everybody some pretty awful names — and now cringe every time I hear my Gmail chime. Post is locked until Tonelico weighs in a final time, should he wanna do so.
The evidence is out there from every imaginable perspective, and I think anybody paying any attention can see on which side the dicks lie. The facts are these: If you read even a wee bit critically, Tonelico does not dispute the decision to boot him from the guild! He was stung, but he gets that an occasional, multi-hundred-hour commitment isn’t enough for you people, and that he should join a social LS instead.
It was the imperious way you guys handled the whole thing that inspired the rant, right? Isn’t that obvious?
When he posted this thing, I was mostly sympathetic. But it wasn’t until the power brokers came in here, feigning hurt and hilariously over-written outrage, that I was totally convinced. You people are monsters, and you make the Internet worse.
Let’s all go enjoy our games, k?
Oh, this is rich. I go to a wedding over the weekend and come back to this shit-storm.
Yeah, it’s our “fail blog” so we get to lock it down. I’m getting the last word in my own space. Go bitch about me on the botdls or something.
Some quick thoughts:
1) Peteybird again makes a point which pretty much every BotD member missed. I agreed with the decision that BotD was no longer the right fit for me, and it probably wasn’t for a long time. Not a social LS, I wasn’t at the events. I got it. That’s fine. I agree with the decision. The issue at hand is HOW people handle things, how people act, the way they talk. It’s all bullshit.
2) To “Confused BotD Member” — once upon a time, I was an extremely active member of BotD. During that time I only had one child and a job that afforded me a LOT of flexible hours. I could name dozens of close BotD friends, though I suspect many of them are now either inactive or have fully left BotD. The situation in my life now is such that I can only afford enough time to keep up on the current content, which brings me to what is probably the most important point…
3) “As a family, we strive for excellence in the areas of Sky, Sea, Cop missions, Zilart missions and any other missions coming from the Final Fantasy Database.” — Hey “Truth-Hammer,” good point! Now, the LS members of current have done a pretty fine job of keeping people up on their WotG missions haven’t they? /sarcasm. Most people haven’t even finished ToAU from what I can tell. It seems to me that rather than calling me selfish, you can just call yourselves slow. I’d be like “hey, who in the LS wants to do ____ WotG mission?” And everyone’s like “uh… we’re 8 missions behind.” Oh, cool. More than once in the last few months did I go and help some LS mates who needed those older missions. Outside of Draylo, those other people I’m pretty sure still haven’t caught up. So if doing Sky/Sea runs 1000 times over is more worthwhile than keeping up with the standard missions, then I guess I am selfish.
4) People didn’t like that I “spammed” the LS? I’d actually be spamming shouts in WG, and maybe once an hour I’d say in the LS “hey, just gonna repeat a WG shout in case anyone’s interested.” Rarely did anyone come, and that’s fine. I just thought people would be interested in these missions. The nature of missions/quests that REQUIRE groups is that it’s not fully selfish but everyone gets something out of it. So…… yeah. I clearly wasn’t fit for BotD in the last 18 months or so. Thanks for kicking me, seriously, it was a good and right thing to do. Sorry for not coming to ZNMs and Sky events, I have to prioritize what I do in the game at this point. But there were nicer ways to kick me than what I experienced, and Anto didn’t have to snub me with his non-responses.
5) Neph — I actually had no idea Deaura/Rubedoe was interacting with ANYONE on the LS during the time he was using my character. I’m actually a little disappointed to hear that. I was just doing the dude a favor. Maybe that’s why people were colder to me than I expected when I came out of a lengthy hiatus. They thought I was him.
Alright, that’s about it. Can’t wait to see y’all in game. I’d love to know who the person was who put this link up on the BotD forums (I haven’t even been over to check it out), but I guess someone is pretty interested in googling their own Avatar name to have found this. That gives me a good chuckle.